A good old-fashioned misogynist -- and a classicist with form

Once you get to be fifty, as I am sure I have gloomily remarked before, invitations to funerals tend to outnumber invitations to weddings. Just while I’ve been in the States, three old Cambridge Classicists have died.

Frank Walbank died a couple of months ago. He had been (and still in a way remained) one of the subject’s real radicals -- not just  writing the standard commentary on Polybius (on whom he gave the Sather lectures), but also a gloriously Marxising treatment of the late Rome empire, The Decline of the Roman Empire in the West.

I only got to know Frank after he retired to Cambridge more than thirty years ago. He was just short of 99 when he died. I vividly remember his 90th birthday party  in Peterhouse, his Cambridge College. The other guest of honour was the man who had been Frank’s Director of Studies when he was an undergraduate, Bertrand Hallward (the first Vice-chancellor of the University of Nottingham, and the man who almost certainly invented the myth that Scipio ploughed salt into the fields when he destroyed Carthage -- see Classical Philology 1986).

Imagine, I remember thinking, what it would be like being 90 and still being 'young Frank' to your old teacher.

Then a few weeks ago, one of my own undergraduate teachers, Geoffrey Woodhead, died. He had been a charming misogynist of the old school, who had vehemently opposed the admission of women into his college. I had taken a very dim view of this at the time. Thirty years on, I think I prefer an old-fashioned out and out misogynist, to the crypto-variety that now stalks the Senior Combination Rooms of Cambridge in left-wing disguise. At least you know where you are with the out and out sort.

Whatever his views, Woodhead had to teach a mixed group of us how to study Greek inscriptions. It was only a couple of weeks into the course that I saw how the misogyny found its expression. When it came to the time when he would ask the class questions, the women of the group were always given very simple ones, often with a house-keeping theme. “What would you do when you first found an inscription Miss Beard?”  “Clean it, Mr Woodhead”, was the right answer. The blokes, on the other hand, got really tough googlies. “Could you compare the letter forms of IG 1.2, 4098 with SEG …whatever.”

I always wondered if he thought I was stupid or not.

Then just last week, one of my best beloved teachers, and later colleagues, died – Dick Whittaker. Dick was a really smart guy, selflessly generous and capable of reducing many a dinner table to incapable laughter, occasionally alcohol assisted. He will be best remembered as an economic historian, in the Moses Finley tradition, but for me it is as the excellent translator of the Loeb edition of Herodian that he will forever remain in my pocket.

He was also the only member of my Faculty to have done time behind bars (unless some colleague is carefully concealing their criminal record). When I was teaching a course on “Classics in the Twentieth Century” a few years ago, I would get Dick – then himself well into retirement – to come along to talk about his career to a seminar group. Cheaply, I kept his identity secret and billed him as the “only Cambridge classicist to have done time”. Speculation grew intense…who was it, the students wondered, concealing a few years for GBH?

In fact it was nothing like that. As much of a radical as Frank Walbank, Dick had taught Classics in Rhodesia (as it then was), and fallen foul of Ian Smith. So it was political imprisonment . The students, of course, were even more impressed.

So, all in all, a sad few weeks.

But there’s some brightness on the horizon too. My first date when I get back in just under three weeks now is another 90th birthday party. This time the guest of honour is my old Director of Studies at Newnham, Joyce Reynolds (pictured here)– who has inspired and helped so many of us. Like Woodhead, she is an epigrapher, and is still in her tenth decade travelling to places that would defeat many of her younger colleagues (Libya, for example) on the hunt for undiscovered Roman inscriptions -- one of the main ways we get new information about the history, life and culture of the Roman world.

I'm hoping active longevity is academically inherited.

Comments

[Anna]

Thank you so much for mentioning Dr Joyce Reynolds. I've heard her lecture and have always her combination of academic rigour and strong, but kindly personality. May she enjoy many more active years.

[Richard]

So what is anonymous-moaner-about-TonyF's-wiki-links' view of books with footnotes, then?

Carry on wiki-referring, Tony!

In the mean time, anxious British regulators seem to have stopped UK wiki-ists from editing as part of an attempt to block access to a potentially illegal picture (apologies for not writing up the whole story myself, Mr/Ms Anon!):
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7770456.stm

Needless to say, by doing so they drew it to the attention of millions. Never having heard or cared about the band in question, I immediately went to google to find out what the fuss was about. It's just a picture of a child with no clothes on.

All best,
Richard

[Tony Francis]

Concerning Wiki: It is fair to say my views have changed since the summer of 2007. I wrote two articles which were viciously attacked, revised, criticized, tagged and (well you can guess the rest). But Wiki won't go away. I felt some obligation to correct clearly erroneous additions to my articles, no matter how much they had been savaged. After I got over my snit with them, I tried writing some other articles. This time I chose subjects that not more than five people in the world were interested in. These have been well received, and the editorial changes have been minor, in good faith, and for the better. I also think Wiki has changed in the last year. A lot of the roving editors who seem to have severe personality disorders have gone away. Either that, or they know who I am now and leave me alone. I think they have added new software which filters out a lot of the the pornographic graffiti that used to plague Wiki.

I have written about 20 articles in the last year. In all honesty, my original articles could have been better.

Whatever one may think of Wiki, it is the future, and it is here now. As I recently posted, even medical journals are speculated to have an on-line, Wiki-like paradigm, where anyone reading the article can make additions or comments. That is what the world wide net has brought us to, and what it has done to us. As Wiki improves, it is the easiest source for a lot of information. That being said, there are a lot of errors and notable inconsistency in it. But then, the same can be said of the 1953 Encyclopaedia Britannica, or any other text or source.

There will always be a place for old style "peer review" type journals. But the intoxication of allowing articles to be amended by anyone who reads them on line is here to stay. One thing I don't like is anonymous comments. If you are going to make an addition to a serious article or subject, you should be brave enough to sign your real name to it. Blogs are one thing. When "Spidermonkey" or "Born Loser" make comments about quantum mechanics or Tacitus, well, it leaves something to be desired.

The trouble is, Tony, that when you say something interesting, about the Tudors for example, you then refer us to Wikipedia. Is that because the interesting thoughts are theirs, not yours? Then the interest tends to drain away. This fundamentalist use of the Wiki drains interest in your own contributions. I mean, just give us the refrrences and we can find the rest ourselves. I have read your problem with Wiki, but it seems you have not integrated them into your own "spirituality". Disgusting word, I know but just trying.

[Tony Francis]

Jackie: Yes, I confused Henry Fitzroy with Edward VI. Neither seemed too healthy.

Concerning women rulers, the mummy of Hatchepsut has been identified in June, 2007. She died at age 50 years from septicemia caused by an abscessed tooth, although she also had metastatic cancer to liver and bone. They did not say what the primary cancer was. She also had Type II diabetes. She was frequently shown with a beard, and her statues were desecrated after her death.
http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hatchepsut
This Wiki article has recently been extended, for the better.

[Neil Panton]

Interesting comments about the Agrippinas. Of course gender historians have done really valuable work on exposing the stereotypes of power-crazed, sexually insatiable women as no more than literary devices, since attacking a woman's reputation was a good way of attacking her power. But what about if an individual woman in the past really WAS vicious, a nymphomaniac etc? We'd risk not acknowledging it because we'd be too used to stripping away the stereotypes - which of course it's usually right to do.

[Tony Francis]

Dear Jackie: I was thinking Edward VI and Henry Fitzroy were the same person. Clearly, they were not.

The story of Hatshepsut is interesting. She was frequently depicted as having a beard. After her death, many of her statues were destroyed, and her name was rubbed out. The Wiki article has been beefed up recently. They positively identified her mummy which was announced in June, 2007. She died from septicemia secondary to an abscessed tooth. The mummy had advanced cancer, apparently metastatic to bone and liver. They don't give the primary source. She was fifty years old.
http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hatchepsut

Then there is all the craziness surrounding Cleopatra.

[Jackie]

Tony, I think you may be mixing up the illegitimate Henry Fitzroy with the legitimate sickly Edward, who did become king for a short while. As for Lucrezia Borgia - she seems to have been the Renaissance equivalent of Augustus' daughter Julia, married off at the political will of her father, a commodity not a person.The two Agrippina's made the mistake of being ambitious in a male dominated world. Of course the writers such as Tacitus would castigate them. They threatened the status quo.

[Tony Francis]

Wiki gives these comments about Agippina I and II:
Agrippina the Elder:
"Agrippina was widely regarded by contemporaries as being a woman of the highest character and exemplary Roman morals, notwithstanding a profound arrogance and a vaulting ambition: Tacitus' verdict is of a woman who "could not endure equality and loved to domineer, [and who] with her masculine aspirations was far removed from the frailties of women" (Annals 6.25).
A superficial assessment views Agrippina as the innocent victim of tyranny. In reality, however, Agrippina herself had done much to provoke her fate. Her constant dwelling on her birth (e.g. Annals 1.40) and her being the "sole surviving offspring of Augustus" (Annals 3.4) was not merely an insult to Tiberius, Augustus’ son by adoption, but also to Livia, who was Julia Augusta only by testamentary adoption; her attitude also implied a challenge to Tiberius' own position."

Agrippina the Younger:
"Note that most ancient Roman sources are quite critical of Agrippina the Younger, because she was seen as stepping outside the conservative Roman ideals regarding the roles of women. Tacitus: Critical view, considered her vicious and had a strong disposition against her due to her femininity and influential role in politics. Perhaps the most comprehensive of Ancient sources. Others are Suetonius and Cassius Dio."

Were these women really evil hateful shrews, or is this just misogyny?

Of course, there is Lucretia Borgia and her various antics. Were these true?

History is mixed about Bloody Mary and QE I. The whole Protestant-Catholic thing gets added to the mix. Then there is all the uneven emotion and metaphor about QE I and her perpetual virginity- cold, calculating, vicious, but also like the Virgin Mary. Still, she is described as "short tempered, indecisive and lucky". Curiously, Henry VIII feared having weak daughters because the memory of the last Norman, Matilda was still fresh. She was viewed as a total disaster:
http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matilda_of_England

Fear of a return to the ineffectual days of Matilda drove Henry VIII to serial wife murder seeking but never obtaining a male heir other than the illegitimate, sickly Henry Fitz Roy who died of tuberculosis at age 15 or 17.

[Jackie]

Tony, what's changed? Agrippina the Younger had the same problem in the 1st century AD!

[Tony Francis]

Dear Marilyn: You are trying to make a connection which doesn't exist - that Obama was elected proves nothing, other than the fact that the country is not as racist as we would have believed. But your visceral reaction to Palin makes my point. You don't like her because she is "a fool" - etc. Never mind that Obama is a 47 year old lawyer who has never had a job. Despite all the rhetoric about change, he has put the same people in charge who caused the economic chaos on the first place (namely Bob Rubin and his minions).

Everyone has focused on reports that "Palin spent $250,000 (or $110,000, or whatever it was) on clothes." Everyone is ignoring the fact that Obama spent $750,000,000 to get about 63 million votes. That is about $13 a vote. My point was that both Hillary and Sarah dredged up deep emotions, both positive and negative which the men didn't. Your reaction only proves it. That is misogyny in my book. What about that fool Biden who can't even put a sentence together without getting something wrong? No one even notices him. Even the Cambridge professor is grinding away at Thatcher, and she has been off the scene for years. Public women bring about deeper emotions than men. They are more polarizing, no matter what their political outlook. I don't think we knew that before this election.

[Marilynn]

To Tony: The fact that Obama was elected does not make our country misogynist! Governor Palin is simply a fool with bad policy and little experience, and was taken to task for it by people disagree with her positions (and lack of positions due to ignorance). The Democratic primary race between Obama and Clinton was very close. Sure we have misogynism and racism in the country as in other places. But it is very simplistic to say that because people strongly like or dislike a female politician, they are misogynist!
Oh, and "guys" has been used for many years, and is used without blushing in reference to mixed company - example "Come on, guys! Let's go!"

[Xjy]

One wonderful teacher makes a huge difference in our lives. Often it more than compensates for all the bullies, bastards, bigots and boneheads. It's the bloodline of good human endeavour. The thread that never breaks, even if it runs thin at times.

More than one wonderful teacher is sheer joy.

Let's not guff about guys, but delight in long, loving lives. Love in the other sense that matters - love of knowledge, skill, mental agility, and imparting all these. A heart warm and nurturing, however spiky and warted the skin protecting it.

I suppose I have to remind you of the line spoken by Peter Sellers in the film "Hoffman*, though I do not recommend it as worth watching. "The trouble with women is that nobody really likes them".

[Tony Francis]

If a male can be called a "smart aleck", is a female then appropriately called a "smart alexandra" or simply a "smart-ess"?

[Tony Francis]

If you call a Jew a "guy", is that a non sequitur or an oxymoron?

[Michael Bulley]

What about “smart”, then? Many BrE speakers, me included, do not use it to mean clever, except in the pejorative expression “smart aleck” or of technology like a smartcard. For us, it is how elderly female relatives irritatingly took pleasure in describing us when we were boys and had been forced to put on uncomfortable ironed clothes and comb our hair for some formal occasion. I think it is just coincidental that there seems to be some connection there with the early sense of the adjective to mean causing pain.

[Jackie]

I don't know about calling females 'guy', but I did have a friend who called me 'chappie'. He was one of the firemen who died in a blaze in Warwickshire last year, and an abiding sadness is that now I will never be called chappie again.

[PL]

XJY: "Guy" in the singular is always masculine, in the plural it can refer to either sex or both. It's alleged to come from "goy" (Yiddish: see a much earlier post), though I'm still inclined to stick with Guy Fawkes. We Yanks invented falsies, the word and the thing (if you mean what I thnk you do).

[Tony Francis]

A female guy is a "guy-ette", "guy-ess" or "guy-en". Maybe we should just use the term in a unisex manner: Guy for girls and boys. Of course there is always "gal". Is "chick-ette", "chick-ess" and "chick-en" redundant? Maybe we could call guys and gals "co-guys".

[Xjy]

Michael, Michael - "guy" is fast becoming the normal word in English for "bloke". Dunno if it's used indiscriminately for chicks as well.

Googly on the other hand - that's a real tie-break! As I'm sure wicket-keeper, five-eighth, lock, netball, bog, oil stove, falsies (?) would be too.

Love the Athena, by the way - the sharpness of line that should delimit a true scholar from us other impressionistis poseurs.

So many wonderful teachers! I had one! And some nice ones, and a few nasties too. Mine died a few years ago - probably kept alive so long by internal pickling. Unfortunately I never got to his funeral.

But I did meet Dr Sandbach over sherry once - his wife was a doyenne of Swedish-English translators, hence my invitation.

Ah yes, inscriptions! So much to do, so little time. God bless the Rosetta Stone! And the desert papyri (can never remember names - yes I can! Oxyrhyncus, right?!). Gotta boast here - one of the two books I read on Latin paleography was in Serbo-Croat :-) Runes are fun too! Hard to think that most of them were inscribed several centuries after the peak of Roman classicism. Like Beowulf of course. So much for the mists of time - in this case, fog.

But gimme the hieroglyphs any old day - so clear, so well-preserved, so beautifully mixed with painting, sculpture, cat-swaddling, and history. Make "our" classical colossi look like puling babes.

All this is hell for manic-depressives and attention-disadvantaged folks like me, though... :(

Great piece, Mary. Too bad you'll be back to the land of "ah bitter chill it was, the hare limped trembling through the frozen grass, numb were the beadsman's fingers as he told... " and greasy Joan keeling the pot under the icicles. I've never been as chilled to the bone as I was in Cambridge one night in an upstairs freezer they called a bedroom. Not even in a wintry Sao Paulo at 4C in a building built to refrigerate for summer temperatures over 30...

But I'm sure Newnham is warm and cosy indoors!

(That was a joke... :-)

[PL]

Tony's right: male politicians every bit as fatuous as Sarah receive less ridicule and less adulation.

[Michael Bulley]

A really smart guy? Sounds like the English of a Briton who's recently spent a bit of time in the USA.

American English speakers may be wondering what a googly is. It's an off break bowled with a leg break action. Hope that clears things up.

Dear Mary

May I send you this obituary from a few years ago? (From The Independent). I knew Professor G. P. Goold. What the obituary omits is that he was for a time Professor of Classics in Rhodesia, whose University was a subsidiary of University College London. I knew Phillipa as well, met her at their grisly flat in the grisly Barbican.

Thursday, 21 February 2002

George Patrick Goold, classicist: born London 15 May 1922; Professor of Greek and Latin, Harvard University 1965-73; Professor of Latin, University College London 1973-78; Editor, Loeb Classical Library 1974-99 (Emeritus); William Lampson Professor of Latin Language and Literature, Yale University 1978-92 (Emeritus); married 1944 Elizabeth Sharples (one son, one daughter; marriage dissolved), 1974 Philippa Forder; died Holyoke, Massachusetts 5 December 2001.

George Patrick Goold, classicist: born London 15 May 1922; Professor of Greek and Latin, Harvard University 1965-73; Professor of Latin, University College London 1973-78; Editor, Loeb Classical Library 1974-99 (Emeritus); William Lampson Professor of Latin Language and Literature, Yale University 1978-92 (Emeritus); married 1944 Elizabeth Sharples (one son, one daughter; marriage dissolved), 1974 Philippa Forder; died Holyoke, Massachusetts 5 December 2001.

G. P Goold was for 25 years, until his retirement in 1999, the Editor of the Loeb Classical Library, the series founded by James Loeb in 1911.

About his editorship of the Loeb series, he complained to me that he had to deal with people who did not know the original languages. Like Professor Lloyd-Jones it would appear (his Loeb Sophocles) - or maybe he did not understand English

[anthony alcock]

I wanted to go to my home university in the mid-1960s to study Classics (about which I was just as passionate as I was about jazz) because of the teachers (Walbank, Austin and others), but I was forced instead to go to Oxford, where I was taught by a nonentity in my college and lost interest in Classics. A good piece, Mary.