Man United: Gerrard or Scholes?

I feel compelled to write this article after I witnessed a goal last weekend which brought me to wonder whether Steven Gerrard is the best midfielder ever to have graced the Premiership. Of course it wasn’t just this goal but the other moments of magic which have been scattered throughout his career. His heroics in Istanbul, the F.A Cup final goal against West Ham and the goal against Olympiakos which caused Andy Gray to come within a millimetre of exploding (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=kM5XP-Ps7tk).

After admiring the way Gerrard lifted the ball over Shay Given to score his second goal on Sunday I was temporarily dumbfounded. My inner Mancunian instinct deserted me as I sat alone in my living room praising the ‘f***ing finish’ I had just seen. Senses regained, I cursed as Gerrard and Liverpool were ‘at it again’. After the game the question remained whether Gerrard was the Premiership’s greatest midfielder yet. My Sunday afternoon then got interesting when a ginger midfield maestro by the name of Paul Scholes popped into my head.

With time to kill and in the interest of impartiality, I decided against limiting this to a two man showdown. I eventually compiled myself a list of six midfielders who I deemed worthy of consideration on my precious Sunday afternoon. There was only one rule – each contender had to have played in at least half of the Premiership seasons. Sunday was then spent contemplating who is/was the best midfielder to have graced the Premiership; Gerrard, Scholes or someone else?

My list consisted of Gerrard, Giggs, Keane, Lampard, Scholes and Vieira.

After much thought I realised some tough decisions had to be made and the list of six was trimmed to three as Vieira, Lampard and Keane failed to make the cut. These three are/were exceptional players, but, when considering the Premiership in its entirety Giggs had to make the final three for his longevity whilst Scholes and Gerrard are, for me, in a league of their own.

I eventually settled for my final two and after wasting more time than I would like to admit, I came back to my original two; Steven Gerrard and Paul Scholes. I began to recall all the goals, passes and comical tackles Paul Scholes had given United over the past 15 seasons and I knew then that Paul Scholes had to win. Relief at last, finally I could begin the numerous other tasks any other rational human would be doing on a Sunday afternoon.

Then it hit me, I had been thinking with just my United head instead of the clear, rational mind which treats me just fine any other day!! My stupid United biased mind had been controlling the whole afternoon’s proceedings. I had to admit that I had discounted Gerrard without so much as a half hour long think about all the dynamic, inspirational goals and dives he had given to Liverpool. The debate rumbled on until I finally succumbed to my United based/biased opinion that Scholesy was the Premiership’s best yet.

15 seasons, 8 Premiership winners medals, 3 FA Cup winners medals, 2 Champions League winners medals compared with Gerrard’s baron Premier League trophy cabinet (sorry but this season might be my last chance to have a cheap ‘Liverpool still haven’t won the Premiership’ dig). Scholesy had won.

For me, Paul Scholes is an absolute legend and, in my well thought out (if not logical) opinion, the best midfielder the Premiership has seen (I accept his last couple of seasons haven’t set the world alight). The guy has class oozing from every pore; even his handball against Zenit nestled perfectly in the top corner. Admittedly, his tackling leaves much to be desired and he is not the all action, Roy of the Rovers central midfielder which Gerrard can claim to be, but, for vision, intelligence, class, elegance in possession and technique, Paul Scholes is way out in front - I think………….....

Craig Malpas

Comments

[dont worry]

Underrated again. All the people who believe Steven Gerrard to be better than Paul Scholes have got it wrong in my opinion.

The debate was about the greatest player having graced the premiership and everyone comes up with examples of how Steven Gerrad did great things in the F.A Cup, Champions League. And if yuo want to include all I can simply say is

Steven Gerrard himself including many other players and managers have pleaded for the return of Scholes to international football because apparently there is no creativity without him in the middle and england needs that spark.

[Matt]

David T:

"What has Ronaldo done in all his matches against Liverpool? Nothing, therefore he is crap and Aurelio/Arbeloa are the best full backs in the world for keeping Ronaldo quiet"

umm scored against them, i believe. and no they arent. its not worth my time arguing why

[Pippo]

David T:

"What has Ronaldo done in all his matches against Liverpool? Nothing, therefore he is crap and Aurelio/Arbeloa are the best full backs in the world for keeping Ronaldo quiet"

"Gerrard hasn't performed against Man U therefore he is crap/overrated"

Nice use of quotation marks.

[joshi in london]

i'm a man united devotee so i'd be slightly biased in sayin scholsey is the best but only because all the top players acknowledge him as so. just cos you watch changing rooms doesn't make you able to judge other in builders- in the same way we should lelert pro footbalplayers judge who they govern as the best, which puts paul at the top. also LAMPARD is in my opinion better than gerrard as an attackin midfielder, and as a DM makalele and keano are on another planet to gerrard. in a nutshell gerrard wouldnt make it in the top two or three best dm or am, he is just a good mixture and a handy player to have given you have all the players mentioned above. he is slightly better than bobby dazzler a.k.a darren fletcher. peace x

[David T]

Even though it is slightly "off topic", Gerrard (and the rest of Liverpool's midfield) comprehensively bossed Keane et al around in League mataches in 2001/02/03, not to mention the League Cup final, Charity Shield etc. Have you forgotton the 30 yard screamer into the top corner scored by Gerrard, (when he was still a kid) which left Barthez with no chance? Now, have Keane or Scholes ever scored a goal anywhere near that good against Liverpool? Addionally, you have to factor in the point that in virtually every match he has played against Man Utd, except in the 2001/02 season, it can be argued that Gerrard has been on the overall weaker team.

The point I'm making is, it's incredibly stupid to say "Gerrard hasn't performed against Man U therefore he is crap/overrated". Firstly, it isn't true (see above), and secondly, you could extend the argument and say "What has Ronaldo done in all his matches against Liverpool? Nothing, therefore he is crap and Aurelio/Arbeloa are the best full backs in the world for keeping Ronaldo quiet"....It's clear that this is a stupid argument.

Alex Ferguson will tell you that Gerrard is better than Scholes. And Gerrard hasn't even reached his peak yet. He is the player of the season so far this season, and if he continues performing the way he has been in the Champions League, I think he will finally win the Ballon D'or next year that he should have won in 2005.

He is a contemporary great who's talent is attempting to be diminished by losers on internet forums and general jealousy from rival fans.

[Craig H]

A journo trolling? Who'd have thunk it.

The only way to gain any kind of comparison is to exchange them into their opposing teams, and ask yourself what would have happened historically. Trophies are given to teams, not players - if they were, then Darren Fletcher would prove to be a better player than Gerrard... I doubt even the most ardent Man Utd supporter would agree with that.

On a one-to-one basis, I'd give it to Gerrard - it'd be close, but it'd be Gerrard. Whilst Scholes may have had better technical skills, Gerrard more than makes up for it with force-of-will, engine and versatility. He also has to command the team, rather than Scholes having Keane nearby doing all the hard graft.

But I think neither player is "complete"... Scholes really cannot tackle, and Gerrard suffers from a lack of simplicity in his passing game (too many thru-balls).

As for you Craig Malpas, all you've proven with your big trophy-fest post, is that Liverpool really are the most successful team in English Football, and that your "moment of clarity" was actually a dawning reality that you might just have picked a comparison that a Man Utd player may not win.

Scholes is a class player, whom I respect greatly, but Gerrard truely is world-class, and his best days may still yet to pass.

[Franco]

Sorry Craig, but to pose such a stupid question underlines what a massive inferiority complex ManU supporters have about LFC. Stop obssessing about us and concentrate on your own team!

[Pack Rat]

They are totally different types of player. If you could clone Bryan Robson, then out of these two you'd choose Scholes alongside him. If you could clone Glenn Hoddle you'd want want Gerrard. Its a team game.

Despite what I've just written, I think most fans would choose for their side to unearth the next Gerrard not the next Scholes. Its players like Robson, Vieira, Keane, and Gerrard who can take a lost game and win it. Scholes, Hoddle, Brooking, etc would never do that unless other players provided the platform first.

[Adam Saint]

I find it funny to read the comments from people about Scholes having great players around him that have supposedly made him a better player, while Stevie G has had to play in a rubbish team.

However, if this is the case, then this makes Scholes even better as he could STILL be picked out as the best midfielder of his generation despite being surrounded by stars but Stevie G is picked out as a shining star from a bunch of 'also rans'.

To say Scholes can't dribble is nonsense, as he can and has shown a change of direction and feint that Stevie G could only dream of (low centre of gravity!). He just doesn't need to 98% of the time as his vision enables him to pick the best pass (remember, a ball travels faster than any human can dribble) to open up the opposition.

You can be a star if you play with Muppets, you are a world class star when you play with stars and shine!

[Eddie]

Conor Murphy

Err...wasn't the title of this blog "Gerrard or Scholes"? Since when does a legbreaker like Roy Keane factor into this debate? And isn't Gerrard vs Keane what we would call "off-topic"?

But seeing as you brought it up, Roy Keane played in the 2003 League Cup final, did he not? and 22-year-old Steven Gerrard outplayed Keane, who is 9 years his senior, with a subsequent LFC victory...so that blows your comparison straight out of the water.

Furthermore, SAF compared Gerrard favourably with Keane the following year when he said "Gerrard is Keane; he is now where Keane was when Roy came to us in 1994", which was 4 years ago.

Keane was never the goal scorer that Gerrard is!

Now back to the point...

[JAMIE]

If Gerrard had a Keane next to him or a Scholes next to him he would have been considered the best ever.

Gerrard won the champions league next to Biscan, Smicer, Hammann & Kewell and made them world beaters. Scholes was next to Keane, Beckham, & Giggs. no doubt Utd had the Better Midfield but Gerrard is a better Player. Utd won the league WITH Scholes, if liverpool win it will be BECAUSE of Gerrard.

[Conor Murphy]

gerrard
great player but when did he ever out play roy keane soory guys keane last game for united he played on one leg against liverpool and still played gerrard off park..... and when has gerrard ever performed against united scholes prob the most underrated player in the priemership hed still get a game for england a head of lampard and gerrard

[Pete]

I'd like to add that in ten years time there will be another player like Gerrard and another like Scholes. There will also be this argument but about different players.

[Trev]

Gerrard.

Even Sir Alex Ferguson did not consider Scholes to be 'World Class'.

When listing the world class players he has managed in his career he named: Peter Schmeichel, Eric Cantona, Ryan Giggs, Roy Keane, Wayne Rooney and Cristiano Ronaldo.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/2352288/Beckham-left-off-world-class-list.html

This was in December 2006.

So if Ferguson said "Gerrard is Keane..." in 2004 when Gerrard was 23 years old, then it is pretty evident who Alex Ferguson thinks is the better player between Gerrard and Scholes.

Scholes was a clever player, a continental type player and therefore a gem in England, but his best is not as good as Gerrard's best. And it's been years since Scholes was consistently putting in top notch performances every week like Gerrard has been for the past 8 or so years. Case closed.

[Trev]

Gerrard.

Even Sir Alex Ferguson did not consider Scholes to be 'World Class'.

When listing the world class players he has managed in his career he named: Peter Schmeichel, Eric Cantona, Ryan Giggs, Roy Keane, Wayne Rooney and Cristiano Ronaldo.

This was in December 2006.

So if Ferguson said "Gerrard is Keane..." in 2004 when Gerrard was 23 years old, then it is pretty evident who Alex Ferguson thinks is the better player between Gerrard and Scholes.

Scholes was a clever player, a continental type player and therefore a gem in England, but his best is not as good as Gerrard's best. And it's been years since Scholes was consistently putting in top notch performances every week like Gerrard has been for the past 8 or so years. Case closed.

[Kev]

***** In response to the following quote from Sir Alex Ferguson in 2004:

"Gerrard has become the most influential player in England, BAR NONE. To me, Gerrard is Keane; he is now where Keane was when Roy came to us in 1994. I've watched him quite a lot, and everywhere the ball is, he seems to be there. He's got that unbelievable engine, desire, determination. Anyone would take Gerrard. Vieira has done that job for Arsenal for two or three years. But you can see Gerrard rising and rising."

Patrick Viera agreed and responded as follows:
"In my opinion he's in the top three midfielders in the world, maybe the best right now.

"I heard what Alex Ferguson said about him being better than me. He's probably right. Gerrard is England's best player and he single-handedly got Liverpool into the Champions League. He is the complete player. He can score, he has a great final ball, he can tackle and he drives his team forward. He is a winner on the pitch, which is why I really admire him."

To reiterate, these comments were in 2004 when Gerrard was 23 years old! So factor in all the improvements in Gerrard's game since and you can probably guess how good both Ferguson and Viera think Gerrard is now.

Scholes was a quality player in his prime, but he went missing for almost 3 years between 2003-2006 due to injuries and lack of form, and hasn't consistently been the same player since. Gerrard has been the most complete midfielder in the country for a good 7 years now.

[Giordano Bennetti]

The best midfielder since the Premiership began is Roy Keane. He has had more impact and influence on teams, matches and titles than any other midfielder.

Vieira probably second.

Scholes has a far better first touch than Gerrard (and almost anyone else currently in the Premiership). And is a quicker and more accurate short-passer. But Gerrard is a fantastic athlete, an inspirational goalscorer, and can grab games by the neck more than any other current midfielder. So I'd say he was third.

But Keane & Scholes are the best central partnership I've seen in English football. Other contenders: Vieira & Petit; Souness & McDermott; Giles & Bremner.

[Marc]

I know this is outside the title of the debate, but these commparisons are offensive. How is Gerrard in any way shape or form better than Vieira or Roy Keane? Both of them were better midfielders, added more to there teams and were more succesful. Do I need to tell everyone what happened every time Gerrard came up against these two or should I spare the author his blushes?

[Peter]

Even at his best (which has long gone) Scholes was a bit of a one trick pony. Stevie G is a class midfielder, the boss in the 'hole' behind the striker(s) and pretty effective tracking back. No 'contest', what contest?

[Roy]

Counting the number of winners medals Scholes has, proves he had a great team around him, Gerrard is regarded as great, whilst sometimes playing alongside mediocraty, the best Goalkeeper in the premiership: Shay Given ....has no medals, medals count for nothing when assessing talent

[Steven Abdul]

GERRARD ALL THE WAY....YNWA!!!!!

[Eddie]

To all the one-eyed mufc fans who aren't bothered to read all the comments and keep posting that "this/that player has acclaimed paul scholes as the best in the world etcetc" -- here's a quote from your OWN manager in 2004 - a man not exactly renowned for keeping both eyes wide open.

"Gerrard has become the most influential player in England, BAR NONE. To me, Gerrard is Keane; he is now where Keane was when Roy came to us in 1994. I've watched him quite a lot, and everywhere the ball is, he seems to be there. He's got that unbelievable engine, desire, determination. Anyone would take Gerrard."

so I repeat...maybe the question should be "who is the most influential player in England"? and the answer is obviously Steven Gerrard.

FERGUSON KNOWS!!

[Gwilym Davies]

Come on boys, think about it. Just because Gerrard needs to play alongside three other midfielders does not make him incomplete. It just makes him a footballer, accustomed to playing in a team with 10 other players. A flaw of which you might also, to his shame, accuse Mr Paul Scholes. The comment about Didi Hamann and the Champions League final seems equally irrelevant - when was the last time you saw Paul Scholes playing without a quality midfield around him? It seems to me he built a substantial part of his career playing next to just about the best defensive midfielder there is. Equally irrelevant is the thought that sheer weight of winners medals is what matters. Gerrard can hardly be castigated because what passed for talent on Merseyside until recently was Djimi Traore. No. The fact is that IF Scholes is the better player, it is because he is the better player, not because Ferguson is a better coach than Houlier, or because Berbatov is a better striker than Keane, or because Ferdinand is a better defender than Carragher, or because Schmeichel was a better keeper than David James. And that is the problem. Because class though they both are, one of them plays for Manchester United, and the other for Liverpool FC.

[Coogie]

Yes create this article just as one of the players is up on Felony charges! Hmm i know a player got knicked! Create an article about the wrong he has commited or create an article about how good he is! Tough choice, but tha latter wins!

[Harry]

Gerrard needs a disciplined midfielder playing next to him - Alonso, Hamman, Mascherano. Even Barry was approached by Liverpool in the summer because the simple truth is this - as world class as he undoubtedly is, Gerrard cannot be trusted on his own. He needs a midfielder next to him who has some restraint, some responsibility, some tactical discipline. Gerrard lacks this, Scholes does not. Above all else that is what counts in central midfield. Zidane, Davids, Figo etc. All have hailed Scholes as the finest they've played against. Enf of, as far as I'm concerned.