The Times's very own James Major gives you the low-down and the prices on the Spanish GP

EG writes: James Major is the online sports editor at The Times. He travelled to Montmelo as a corporate guest but watched the race as an ordinary punter sitting in the stands. (I tried to get him a pass for the paddock but failed!). Here are his impressions of the value for money side of it, the racing and the crowd. Completing the job, James has filed his best pictures at the end(click on images to enlarge).

James Major writes: With only the 1992 British Grand Prix under my belt - I watched Nigel Mansell storm to victory on a terrific day at Silverstone in 1992, paying £5 for entry - I approached the Spanish Grand Prix as an F1 novice. Let me know whether you agree with my first impressions of the "Formula One Experience"...

Cost

Wow. I was glad I wasn't paying. My ticket for grandstand access for the three days was €406. That's about £320, $630 or 15,000 roubles.

Bernie Ecclestone is 24th in this year's Sunday Times Rich List with a wealth of £2,400million and now I've got a better understanding why.

They were excellent seats - right opposite the Ferrari garage and start-finish line - but I wouldn't fork out that amount of my own money to go.

Still, 132,600 people - the crowd on race day in Barcelona - voted with their feet so it's difficult to see any downward pressure on pricing anytime soon.

An assortment of other prices:

Lunch in the Aramark "Gourmet Grill" - €45
- Including a plate of paella-style rice, a barbecued chicken leg, a paper-thin slice of pork, a few chips, a greek salad, a small tub of ice cream and a bottle of mineral water. It was all cold - the bits that were supposed to be and the bits that weren't - and not particularly gourmet.

A large beer: €12. Cold, fizzy, refreshing, expensive.

A bottle of mineral water: €3. Cold, wet, expensive. And with no lid - was this so people couldn't throw the lid, the full bottle or just had to buy more water?

Cuisine

See above.

Alternatives: Bring your own picnic. Recommended.
A selection of sandwiches and bocadillos.
And that's about it.

Glamour

Toyota win hands down for their commitment to pit-lane glitz.

Revisit the picture above.

Crowd and atmosphere

There were two big bands of supporters: those supporting Alonso and the hordes that follow Ferrari around the world (plus a few partying Finns). In the grandstand, there were the cheers for Alonso and jeers and a few gestures for Hamilton, but none of the unpleasant behaviour many had feared. I'd be interested in hearing from anybody who was up on the hill and scattered around the track - what was your experience? I saw no evidence of any racism. There was an eager buzz of anticipation all around the circuit and the crowd - a real mix of the sexes - was clearly having fun.

The racing

Loud, fast and impressive. The prices are high but the product is strong. The race was a bit of a procession and Kimi Raikkonen didn't much look like losing for most of the weekend, but there was plenty of drama and skill. When Heikki Kovalainen slammed straight into the tyre wall there was also a stark reminder of the risks the drivers take.

We were sat slap bang opposite the Ferrari garage and, as impressive as anything, was the precision with which everybody operated. The movements of cars in and out of the pit lane was like a well-choreographed dance.

Qualifying was good. Hamilton was quickest on the final lap of the third session but it was difficult to have any real idea of the strength of his time. It all became apparent as driver after driver came inside his mark, relegating him to fifth on the grid. The Spanish went mad when Alonso - who appeared to be running light on fuel - seized pole, with celebrations tempered a little moments later when Raikkonen went quickest.

On Sunday, there was a brief moment when it looked as if Hamilton could mount a late challenge on Massa, but it became apparent quickly that Ferrari's No 2 was putting the final touches to an excellent weekend for the Scuderia.

In summary

An excellent weekend, but at prohibitive cost. Go and see it for yourself, but if you’re strapped for cash, consider yourself warned.

James Major went to the Spanish Grand Prix courtesy of Grandstand Motor Sports Tours

 

Comments

[Alfredo Nieto]

It's nice to see a British journalist NOT referring to Spanish fans as a pack of rabid racists that follow F1 only because of Alonso.

Guess this entry dismantles most comments made here by many English readers of this blog...

Ed, I can't believe it. Two racing posts in the same morning and only with one tiny little sly reference to Fernando. Maybe you are becoming a true motor correspondent? ;)

[B Cave]

James Major, I saw this posted on the BBC sport site which I found horrifying but not surprising if this site is any indication of what Spanish Alonso fans are like. You wanted to know the experience of other people at the Barcelona GP:

"First of all - you may have read my short (and rather sharp e-mail) which was written in a hotel lobby, with a queue behind me. Now I am back at work, maybe a chance for me to be more level headed.

Do I love F1? God, yes. Do I love visiting GP's? Absolutely. Did I enjoy this weekend? No.

I think my stand at Turn 3 was maybe one of the more 'partisan' sections of the track, and I am sure the problems I experienced were not as widespread as I may think. But some points to consider:

1) Saturday was uncomfortable for an English fan group like us cheering on Lewis (and JB, DC and AD for that matter). It got worse as the day went on. Some boos as we took our seats then got steadily worse after the AM practice had finished, and by the time qualy kicked off I decided to complain to a steward. We had been spat and and very aggresively shouted at by large numbers of fans (not everyone, lets be realistic). I wont cry racism - as I dont understand Spanish). My friend had his 6 year old boy with him who was so upset he had to go home, and I am devastated for him. On Sunday, the race got worse, when Lewis got past Alonso, but when FA broke down, half of them went home which was laughable in itself.

2)The problem is, the stewards didn't understand us. I complained to the info booth behind the main stand, and to be fair they sent someone along (apparently) but nothing happened. They just panicked when I said I was sending off pictures, but then threatened legal action so I am not sure where that would leave me!

3) Other incidents of note - Lewis and Fernando were together on the driver parade, and fans were shouting (in English) to FA - get your hands off that animal etc etc.

4) And finally, I am so ashamed to say I lost my rag when I had a drink thrown over my head (yeah, I laugh now!) I had my godson crying, and the race was only 5 laps old (it was his first GP). So when FA broke down (in front of us!) we went totally and utterly ballistic (about 20 or 30 Brits in all)

We were not louts and hand on heart just went to cheer on our own home hero. It was a sad weekend.

I am not going to Silverstone (as my first child is due on 2nd July!) but I really hope that the country can get behind the home drivers in a supportive way and show that we know how to behave. And if Lewis wins, all the better."

[Carleton Twitchell]

Interesting , in other words one humungous rip-off! Check out the Canadian GP prices and you'll see a huge difference in a continent where they struggle to fill the stands.Devotion to any sport or fashion is very vulnerable to such pressures..new soccer kits ,designer trainers and bags,etc.I dread the day we're all buying air to breath..just look at water since the '50s. All grist to the mill.
Thanks JM but I'll take Eds inimitable read anyday.Hi to Big John.

[Rony, Tel Aviv]

JM writes: 'They were excellent seats - right opposite the Ferrari garage and start-finish line.'

Actually, these are the worst seats; best seats are at corners, not staights (unless you are into pits work, in which case I would recommand gymnastic, water-dancing or your local garage.)

Maybe I can use this occasion to call for a BAN on refuelling? Bring the action from the pits back to the track!

[The Kitchen Cynic]

Confiscating the cap of the bottle you have just bought is to prevent you refilling it from a standpipe or tap. They do it at many music festivals now too.

Also has the added attraction to the retailed of increasing the chance of spillage.

Absolutely shameless.

[B Cave]

Just seen another comment by someone who was at the Barcelona GP: "As well as the whistles and jeers experienced by many on Sunday we also saw a group of Spanish Fans after the Race queing up to have their photograph taken with an Anti-Hamilton poster. (See Dailymail web site to see what the poster was).

After asking these fans very politely to stop being racist and to remove the poster we were jeered and told to leave Spain.

We walked away with a mass of abuse ringing in our ears, only to return 2 minutes later with 2 Spanish police officers, who very helpfully confiscated the offensive poster.

Our photographs of the poster will be going to F1, who should have taken action long before the end of the race......"

These people just sound plain evil.

[D]

^
Does he always wear make-up and long hair?

Oh well, each to his own, I guess. Red suits him. And his little bootees are sweet. How does he get that flag though the turnstile at Wapping, though?

(Sorry James; no offence intended - just a joke; couldn't resist it. Hope you had a great time, mate!)

Not surprised you're having trouble getting extra passes these days, Ed...

Next time, ask your buddy Garside to help. Now that his own has been replaced with a solid gold one for services rendered to the FIA president, I'm sure he can rustle up half a dozen at the drop of a hat.

It isn't as if he has much to do on his own blog, is it?

Way things are going for Max, though, Garside had better start toadying up to the Toad very soon if he want to carry over his Bernie points.

[Mark]

Some contrasting information from the US GP (which will hopefully resume next year):

Cost:
Tickets for Thur pitwalk and Fri/Sat/Sun about $110 per person. Thursday pitwalk is free to people who already purchased tickets for the race. Friday and Saturday seating is open. Our Sunday seats are high in the stands just past T1, so we can see the main straight through about T7 and there is a jumbotron right across from our seats.

Cuisine: They don't call it that in Indiana. Lunch (BBQ, fries and a drink) is about $8. A bottle of water (we let you keep the cap in the US :-) is $2. The large size cans of Fosters are $5 and regularly sized beers are $3 to $4, depending on the brand.

Crowd and Atmosphere:

Very friendly. The crowds seem to be about 70% Americas (Canada, US, and Central and South America)and 30% everything else. I've heard Arabic to Urdu. Lots of Germans, lots of UK, a bunch of Poles last year. No incidents I have seen (and I have been to all of them) except when a very drunk Ferrari fan shouting "F**k Alonso" at the top of his lungs ran around the corner and smack into a large group of fairly drunk latin men, all wearing Renault gear. Not a smart move.

The Racing:

That's a problem at the moment, but hopefully soon fixed. The racing is usually good and there are many good vantage points for photographs, many of them above the fence line for the auto-focus challenged.

[Kohque]

I am going to the Singapore Grand Prix in September and the seats in the Pit Grand Stand are at around HK7000 (~640euros). I got two for around 80 euros in the Bay Grandstand, the cheapest one around. I wanted to spend a bit more to get a seat in Raffles or Stamford stand, but all the seats there are already booked (2 contiguous seats).

I don't mind paying for a seat in the Pit Grandstand once a year, but in return I would like Bernie, Mosley & Co. to make people have a great time by creating a more level playing field among teams and make the car less obvious than the drivers. More competitive races and lower entry costs for new teams would also attract the attention of more fans and prop up Formula 1 as one of the top sports worldwide.

It is not like they don't know this, but I guess that politics and the weight of big car manufactures play still the biggest role.

[Wim]

I absolutely agree, James.
Being Belgian I try to attend the Spa Grand-Prix every year. Its is one hell of an experience every year again. But prices are a bit absurd.
A GP weekend with my 4 year old son costs me at least 1.500 euros.
But when the cars pull out and I see the look on his face, a mix of fear and pure excitement, it's all worth it.
Bottom line: They put up one great show, but it's far from the working class spectacle it was when my dad took me to Spa in the eighties.

[del scotland]

Having just come back from Spanish GP i totally echo your comments. We were obviously at the same race. The prices inside the circuit were very expensive. The prices in Monaco are far cheaper. Its a shame because the circuit itself was great for viewing the cars. The reason for the bottle tops was in case you threw them on the track. What a load of crap. If you wanted to throw something the area round the stands had plenty decent stones you could of launched if you were that way inclined. It was just a con to make you buy more. Silly really since you can take you own bottles in with the lid still attached. And a comment on the Toyota girl pictured above. You have to see her in real life because the picture does her no justice. She gets prettier every year..

[Juan]

B CAVE sorry but your story is quite inconsistent. I think we have a very unbiased point of view from The Times correspondant.

Pretty good post, Ed. Thanks for trying to settle down some people.

[Johnny P-)]

Sorry Caveman, but having read your last 20 posts I won't give you much credit this time.

On the other hand, I apologize from all these Spanish countrymen (I'm sure there are some) which stupidly and without any trace of common sense behave exactly as only hooligans are supposed to. They are a negligible minority but conveniently amplified, their nonsense can be turned to whatever "ism" any biased commenter wants.

[B Cave]

Juan, shame on you for denying the truth. It doesn't mean it doesn't exist just because you deny it. I suppose making excuses for despicable behaviour at GPs to opposing fans is as bad as say ... making excuses for "alleged" Nazi-style sexual fantasies with 5 prostitutes involving the head of a huge international organisation or ... making excuses for someone blackmailing their own team.

[Jordi]

That's what Ron Dennis said about Spanish fans.

http://www.elmundo.es/elmundodeporte/2008/04/29/motor/1209488895.html
-“FERNANDO FANS WERE VERY FRIENDLY”

D Cave;"...So when FA broke down (in front of us!) we went totally and utterly ballistic (about 20 or 30 Brits in all)"

Well, D CAVE, you should ask yourself if such behaviour was racist. To cheer when Alonso breaks down is not any different than having your picture taken in front of a poster saying "Anti-Hamilton zone".

Not liking Hamilton makes me as racist as you not liking Alonso.

What is it exactly what you do not understand?

Calling people racist without a reason is as much of an insult as been racially abused.

Now, please drop the racist nonsense.

You see shadows everywhere, if Hamilton had Heikki accident you would be clamming sabotage as you have done before.
Give us a break, will you?

All the best with you first baby!

[Dean Rodrigues]

B Cave - can you provide a link for that article? If true, it's outrageous. Albeit unsurprising from everything we've heard.

I think a parallel can be drawn with football matches. I daresay James Major had the equivalent of a "Club Wembley" ticket - one out of the price range of your average Joe Bloggs - and as such would have been surrounded by, for want of a better expression, a "higher class" of Spaniard (or anyone else for that matter). However, in other parts of the circuit this would not have been the case, just as in other parts of a football stadium you are more likely to get foul-mouthed abuse.

The issue is clearly not pandemic across Spain. But for anyone - Spanish or otherwise - to deny that it is an issue when so many reports across so many sports continue to report instances of it - is simply living in a dreamworld. It should be acknowledged and dealt with, and massive credit to Lewis & Alonso for leading by example on the drivers' parade.

Juan - how do you define/what do you mean by "inconsistent"? the story seems perfectly "consistent" to me...

[Castor]

">B CAVE sorry but your story is quite inconsistent.<

How do you KNOW that, Juan?

[Castor]

Here's the link requested of B. Cave:-

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A35260445

[B Cave]

Dean Rodrigues, here's the link (I presume it's the same one that Castor kindly gave): http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A35260445

Yes, it is unsurprising when you look at the messages on here. And James Major must have been in the "posh seats". The nastiness on this blog from some Spanish Alonso fans is mindblowing, and it is just an extension of what happens on the stands.

[otro javier]

Maybe the B Cave story is not that inconsistent, but it’s, at least, quite curious. Having been B Cave extremely “consistent” in criticizing almost everything about Spanish FA fans, and the Spanish press, and Spanish food and wine, and Spanish weather, and FA and his parents too, don’t you think it’s a pretty happy coincidence that he finally go to Spain to find the things are EXACTLY the same, even in the most irrelevant aspects, that his “consistent” prejudice?.

[Juan]

You seem the only one, B CAVE, who had any problem with spanish fans. The other day in the match Manchester-Barcelona, there were quite a lot of interviews for a radio cast and every single briton was astonished how good they were treated by spaniards.

Even Ron Dennis declared that he was surprised by the amability shown by spanish fans towards him and the Mclaren team.

The Times Correspondant tells the whole britih audience how settled and calm&funny spanish fans are.

HOW COINCIDENT that one of the most aggressive and biased blog´s reader towards spanish fans is the unique one who had a bad experience in Barcelona and even claimed that spanish fans showted something to alonso in english!

Stop imagine things and posting it. Sorry, but taking into account your previos posts it is quite difficult to me to believe any single word coming from you about this certain topic.

[Johnny P-)]

Nothing to contribute from your own against Spain? Of course not. B Cave, you better forget about Spin or you will die from a heart attack.

I think this is a very good post, pointing out how expensive is to attend a F1 Grand Prix. Especially because the character's experience on other sports events. I'm sure many of us think it's a very valuable opinion.

See ya!

[bigbird]

Well, B Cave, you're really obsessed with the "Spanish issue", it's really boring to read your posts saying the same things every single time, you always find the way to throw rubbish around no matter the issue of the post. So, could you please change the subject, or even better, leave us alone speaking about F1 and go joining any anti-Spanish blog wherever. Thanx in advance.

[B Cave]

Otro Javier, in your desperation to excuse the Spanish Alonso fans described in my post, you have made some howling errors. Firstly, I made it quite clear in my post that it wasn’t me who had this experience at the Spanish Grand Prix, but a man who went there with some friends (including a 6 year old child) who posted his experiences on the BBC website. I added another comment from another person who posted similar experiences on the same website. There is no excuse for this thuggish, unsporting, racist behaviour, and as James Major asked for other people’s experiences in Barcelona, it seemed apt to share this.

Secondly, yes, I do criticise some Spanish Alonso fans when they behave in this despicable manner and like all things that should change, it has to be highlighted first, not hidden away and ignored. I’m also not at all keen on Alonso, for his appalling behaviour last year towards his team and Lewis. As for the Spanish press, I hear ‘Marca’ is pretty bad when it comes to anything to do with Alonso, and has appalling racist comments posted to its website, but this I only heard from someone posting here. I don’t understand Spanish, so I wouldn’t have said anything about the Spanish press. As for the Spanish weather, food and wine, I would love you to produce a comment from me criticising them … I’ve been to Spain a few times and it has much nicer, warmer weather than here and the food is okay (not as much variety as in London but then it’s not as cosmopolitan as London). As for Alonso’s parents, er yes, do lie down, is all I can say.

Your post is ridiculous to say the least. Quite amusing though.

[B Cave]

Juan, it wasn't my experience; how tiresome to have to spell it out again. Please see the link I posted. Instead of criticising me for posting other people's experiences in the non-posh stands of the Spanish GP, maybe you ought to be truly horrified that these things actually go on, such that children are so upset they have to leave the stand. Again, shame on you for not reacting in an appropriate way ... but hardly surprising. At least some on here are appropriately horrified by what happened.

As for Ron "praising Spanish fans", it's called diplomacy. I hear Lewis has so much security in Spain now because of what happened before, that none of this would have got near the McLaren garage, thank God.

[B Cave]

Bigbird, I got a solution to your boredom problem. Why don't you just not read my posts?

[JACOB]

Ed, since Alonso is not in Mclaren:

1-Mclaren don´t have a winning car
2-Hamilton can´t have Alonso telemetry and is not ahead
3-There is not a world champion driven for Mclaren
4-This blog has became very boring

Sometimes when God want´s to punish us he gives us our wishes.

[P T Klee]

"I’ve been to Spain a few times and it has much nicer, warmer weather than here and the food is okay (not as much variety as in London but then it’s not as cosmopolitan as London)."

Here you demostrate you haven't been in Spain ever, XD

[Jordi]

B CAVE

You choose to believe the post from a person that you have never meet over hundreds if not thousands of post, journalist, teams, drivers comments saying how good Montmelo was.

You call people "plain evil" for having a picture taken next to a Anti-Hamilton poster, but also you find very funny to cheer when Alonso breaks down.

Can't you see that you are as bad as them?

What's wrong with you?

[MDA]

B Cave, Castor -

Following your indications, I have checked the BBC site for the full report on the posts that you have included here. As I have posted previously, I don`t want to imply that they are necessarily untrue, but there are certain issues (listed below) that make me take these posts with certain caution:

- In the first post the author explains how his group of English fans were shouted at in Spanish by a large number of Alonso fans. Those same fans are said to have switched into English to address Alonso during the driver parade. I find their choice of language (and the language skills of the crowd) quite unlikely.

- Also in that post, the author states that, while surrounded by a very nasty crowd and having young children with them, they chose to cheer when Alonso broke down. Apparently, nothing happened afterwards, i.e., no reaction from the hostile crowd.

- Finally, in the second post there is a reference to a racist, anti-Hamilton poster that can be found in the Daily Mail website. I have searched through it, and I have indeed found a picture of a poster that reads "Anti-Hamilton Zone", with a picture of LH and a second person (I cannot say if that person is his father or Ron Dennis), both of them with an "X" over them. Unpleasant, unsporting - but not racist as claimed by the post. Obviously, we know nothing about the things that fans were shouting, or maybe this is not the poster the post was referring to. But lets not forget that racism is a very serious issue, too serious to be used lightly against anyone.

I believe that Dean Rodrigues makes a very good point in drawning a paralelism with football matches (he chose Wembley as an example, but the same could be applied to any football stadium in any country): the more popular a sport becomes, the more likely that you find unpleasant people mixing with true fans in an increasingly large crowd of attendants to events. I dare to say that for those people, sport alliegances are just an excuse to abuse others. This is not specific of a certain country, in this case Spain - remember people at Silverstone cheering when MS had an accident there, or at Monza shouting abuse at FA when he broke down (just because he was beating Ferrari on that year). Also, these are minorities, lets not generalise and blame a whole group of fans or a whole country.

As for Spanish vs British food, I defer to D and IDR, who seem to be real experts in these matters... ;-)

My apologies to everybody for a rather long post!

[serranohamfan]

Watch this video:

http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=BGSoqUZQYeE.

It seem that the weekend was calm and there hadn't any problem at all, though

[MDA]

One more thought on B Cave`s comment about LH having to have a high level of security when he goes to Spain.

After Monica Seles being stabbed by a supporter of Steffi Graf, I am ready to believe that any high-profile sportsperson is at risk from crazy people that turn a rival sportsperson into a semi-god.

It would, therefore, be unwise for LH not to have security around him, and obviously Barcelona and Valencia would be "high-visibility" venues. But the same applies to FA in Silverstone, I would expect him to have extra-security. Sad, but true, and as the saying goes, better safe than sorry.

We cannot prevent crazy people from getting obsessed with someone, but we can try not to fuel those obsessions. In this sense, the press can play a crucial role by not turning minor incidents into major issues, or dwelling into personal confrontations among sportspersons.

Just a thought...

[Ruben]

In spain racism exist, yes it's true, many people hate gipsy,black people,muslim,chinese, etc. Some of them go to f1 races. This is a fact.
But i wonder. Is no people in england or other countries like that? If LH was albin, don't you think that the people in montmelo past carnival were dressed with white clothes an white hair? Is this fact of racism?
There is good spaniards and bad spaniards. We have a poor culture on f1. But on motorbikes since many many years fans were supporters for pilots who came from another countries(wayne garner, mike doohan, wayne rainey,valentino rossi)even on spaniards riders.
So i think that all is a question of time.
For first time we have a magic star on this sport.
Best regards

[Johnny P-)]

Going back to JM's comments:

- I fully agree, as many Spanish people do, that prices at F1 are excessive for the any sports event.

- As far as I know Aramark's almost a monopoly on feeding at high-standing sports facilities. There is no competition on it and unfortunately they are providing sh** food at every stadium, court or track. God bless you got the gourmet bits from them! Think about regular "bocatas" at football stadiums.

- For the bottle tips issue, they are forced to do so by Law -a practice born at UEFA's tournaments to help avoid injuring players from being hit by those 1/2 Kg missiles. An open bottle may not reach the target and may not harm anybody's face from an impact.

MARK: I really envy you US Americans with such a developed and varied motorsport landscape. You also raise my pain by telling me how affordable and pleasant is to attend qualifying/racing. From different reasons, that really makes the score from F1, GP2 and other "World" Championships. Some years ago I enjoyed watching Indycar racing on night TV, and currently I would prefer to travel to the US and attend a couple of events there better than F1 GP.

Best regards.

[Juan]

Im sorry B Cave. I just understood it as if it were your personal experience.

But you wont deny me the hilarious situation of spanish fan shouting to Alonso in english when one of the current problems in Spain consists of people lacking of proper english knowledge (Me,too).

[Anon]

To B Cave: Apparently Ron Dennis, out of all people, doesn't agree with you.

http://www.planetf1.com/story/0,18954,3213_3497009,00.html

[J, Perez]

B. Cave, you're the dude that complained because he had his Spanish home demolished (probably for being an illegal construction)?

On the other hand, you accusations already smell. Please, calm down. Your hatred makes you look silly. And sometimes silly people make silly things, (remember Heysel?)

[D]

^
B Cave >

I can't find the piece in the Daily/Sunday Mail newspaper's website to which you refer.

Could you post a link to it?

Thanks.

[B Cave]

Just read this on the ITV website from Ted Kravitz who was actually there. It seems some Spanish Alonso fans behave disgustingly, and as much as Juan or that "magic" man want to spew out excuses or nasty insults to me, a fact is a fact. Why don't these people accept it and apologise on behalf of these despicable people? All I can conclude if they don't is that they agree with this sort of behaviour.

"Thankfully there was no repeat of the racist abuse we saw here in February, but we have received reports of Hamilton fans being abused in the grandstands by Alonso fans, which do not show the otherwise excellent Spanish supporters in a good light.

I myself witnessed a disturbing display of whistling, jeering and rude gestures being directed at Lewis as he walked down the pit lane after the second session on Friday.

It was pretty nasty, and all the more surprising as it came from the inhabitants of the main pit straight, who would have paid most for their seats!

In any case, all this anti-Hamilton vitriol from the Spanish misses the point. It was McLaren and Ron Dennis whom Alonso fell out with, not Lewis personally.

And before you write in, no, I don’t expect it to be the same against Alonso at Silverstone. Not least because Fernando has a lot of British fans, myself included."

And Juan, before you think I said I was a fan of Alonso and burst a gasket, it was TED KRAVITZ OF ITV WHO SAID THE ABOVE.

[B Cave]

J Perez, I have no idea what you're talking about - demolished house? You must keep taking the tablets.

If I were you, I'd be more concerned by the raw, unadulterated hatred displayed by some of your countrymen towards a decent incredibly talented, wonderful sportsman and man. The only hatred I have is towards bigotry and bad sportsmanlike behaviour.

Anon, as I said before re. Ron Dennis - it's called diplomacy.

To MDA, I wouldn't put British and London food in the same category. Food in most of Britain except the big cities is pretty cr**. Food in London is exceptional, so many varieties and every price and cuisine you could want. I couldn't see much variety in Spain, but maybe it's just because I went to Barcelona, Madrid and Granada, although some on here bizarrely think I am lying about having gone to Spain at all.

[ALLMAN]

Here is the pic you are looking for:

http://es.tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2lsznra&s=3

[Juan H]

B Cave and alike,

will you please comment on the post posted by Allman at 15.17?

I do not like abuses, from any country, but, what about you?

[Anon]

To B Cave:

"We weren't racing Kimi, we were racing Fernando."

Dennis isn't really a king of smart, diplomatic comments as exemplified by this comment. And he could have kept silent or speak out if racism happened. Are you suggesting that Dennis would have said this if he saw bad behavior?

[B Cave]

Juan H, as hard as I look, I cannot see a post by Allman at 15.17. Would love to have answered it.

[Anon]

Juan H s referencing the time of he post (what hour it was posted).

Here it is:

Here is the pic you are looking for:

http://es.tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2lsznra&s=3

Posted by: ALLMAN | 2 May 2008 15:17:54

[Juan H]

B. Cave,

may be you were confused because I wrote 15.17 instead of 15:17?

Anyway, you seem a very sensitive person, and wondered if that is a general trend or only when it refers to people from other countries. In the photo linked by Allman I can see some smiling (probably British, or at least on top of a British flag) people with what seems a Ferrari pilot (probably Schumi) hanging on his neck. It looks like that is happening at Silverstone.

Please comment on that, how would you exactly define those people, and what conclusions do you draw from your country.

Thanks

[P T Klee]

"Food in London is exceptional, so many varieties and every price and cuisine you could want. I couldn't see much variety in Spain, but maybe it's just because I went to Barcelona, Madrid and Granada"

You should try other restaurants than McDonnals...
Best World Restaurant: Bulli (spain)
3/10 of the best restaurants are spanish.

Variety: If you have really have travelled around Spain (I think you are lying) you have seen how region are extremely different in culture, buildings and language (get away from the cities to see it better)

And for your knowledge of real spanish behaviour: READ OTHER PRESS!!! link me news from other countries ->in other languages<- talking about how bad we behave on Spanish GP....

[J. Perez]

How easy is for you, B. Cave, to accuse other people, Spaniards in this case, when British hooligans have behaved like the 10 plagues when going to sporting events abroad. How idiotic is to smear a whole country's reputation on the behavior of a minority, too.

Please, Mr. Cave, re-read your past posts and think whether they've been fair.

The tablets reference, as the rest of your insults, lacks finesse. Unless you want us to take for the red-neck you're, please be more creative.

[J. Perez]

B. Cave said "Why don't these people accept it and apologise on behalf of these despicable people? All I can conclude if they don't is that they agree with this sort of behaviour."

Why should Juan apologize for the not yet proved behavior of a minority of fans? Have you personally apologized for the Heysel Stadium Massacre caused by rabid British fans? Or the street battles of British fans against North African locals in Marseilles in France 98? Why was England threatened with not taking part in the 2000 Euro cup? Etc, etc, etc....

[Anon]

Interesting. Found this comment on a recent thread:

hi
went to my first grand prix at montmelo and all i seen was typical british loutish behaviour.A group of ferrari suporters were taking photos of themselves afterwards when brits jumped all over them with thier union jacks etc - wasnt nice to see. no matter what the sport a minority of brits will always let us down. We have to remember that we Dont rule the waves any more

Posted by: JONNY D | 2 May 2008 23:35:35

(This isn't sort of ccusation I am making, just trying to debunk the idea that Spaniards are worse spectators than anyone else).

[Jordi]

How interesting that since Allman give us a link to a picture of F1 British fans acting like hooligans, B cave as disappeared. Perhaps he is writing a loooong apology.

B CAVE started this by trying to prove that there were racist attacks in Montmelo.

"...After asking these fans very politely to stop being racist and to remove the poster we were jeered and told to leave Spain."

Now he seems happy to accept that there was only a few:

"...whistling, jeering and rude gestures being directed at Lewis"

Perhaps B CAVE now understands that whistling, jeering and rude gestures happen in 99% of sports events, even in events without black people involved.

Well done B Cave, that's a step forward to overcome you paranoid racism victimize obsession.

Keep taking your tablets.

[AndyG]

This is very boring and partisan but I can't resist jumping on the restaurants sub-theme. If any of the anti-Britain posters stopped to acquire some knowledge for a minute they would know a little more about the world's best restaurants, how many of them are in London and the rest of Great Britain and even a little more about El Bulli and it's British parallel, the Fat Duck. Wise-up, the world wants to be in London not Spain.

[IDR]

“Wise-up, the world wants to be in London not Spain.”

TOP 10 RESTAURANTS IN THE WORLD
1 El Bulli Spain
2 The Fat Duck UK
3 Pierre Gagnaire France
4 Mugaritz Spain
5 The French Laundry USA
6 Per Se USA
7 Bras France
8 Arzak Spain
9 Tetsuya’s Australia
10 Noma Denmark

In fact, London and UK in general has improved a lot in the list of the 50 Best restaurants in the world, as USA. Well, corporate credit cards paying the bills, is a nice way to improve quality!

I have not been in the Fat Duck yet, but I love Hakkasan (19th in the list), much better than the one you find in Madrid.

In any case, if you look at the top ten there are 3 Spanish, two Americans, two French and only one from UK, Australia and Dennmark. (I was invited at Noma and I didn’t liked at all despite I have not paid the bill).

I’m afraid that the world likes to be in London… for working, but prefers to come to Spain for lunch!

[MDA]

Not my intention to trigger a discussion of food quality in London and in Spain with my post - I just wanted to finish it on a lighter note. I have enjoyed D and IDR's exchange of tips about wine, food, and even recipes in this forum (I am learning a few things to impress my guests with...). I know that it is off-topic, but please keep on giving us some recommendations now and then!
I agree with B Cave that you can find top quality food in London, with a very wide range of styles. I find that well-known restaurants in London are very expensive (not that El Bulli is cheap!), but I have a few favourite ones that are very nice and reasonably priced (nothing sophisticated, though). And I share IDR's appreciation of Hakkasan - I didn't know that there was one in Madrid, I must try it! As for Spain, maybe we could suggest a few names that all British friends could try when visiting. Again, IDR is probably a better advisor, but here goes my contribution (in Madrid): "La Trainera", top quality fish and seafood, moderately expensive (by London standards).

[Anon]

I have gone to "Le Grand Vefour" in Paris. onderful restaurant, got to see the tables where great historical people sat traditionally. For example, I saw the table where Napoleon ate.

I know a few great restaurants in Switzerland which I've heard are the best around. Don't remember their names off the bat however.

What is the name of the oldest restaurat in the world? I know its in Madrid- I ate there- but I don't remember the name. It was delicious food, however.

[IDR]

@MDA

The Options for international cuisine in London is so much larger for sure than in Madrid, although Price/quality ratio in Madrid is much better.

You can find Hakkasan in Madrid located in an urbanisation quite close to Madrid "La Moraleja". The prices are cheaper by far than the one in London, but the quality is lower too (as the ambience and decoration), but nice enough for the prices you have to pay for (€40 per person).

La Trainera is one of the most known restaurants for seafood in Madrid. Lobster is one of his most appreciated specialities. The only problem I find is the small side (and number) of tables (if you go for business, you have to be careful about how is behind you!), but the quality is wonderful.

@ ANON

The restaurant I think you mentioned is Casa Botín in the oldest zone of Madrid. (Cava Baja). I wouldn’t say this is the oldest restaurant in the world, but for sure is the oldest one in Madrid. They started in the 18th century as a “Casa the postas” (I don’t know how to translate into English but that was the place for changing the horses for the diligences).

Quite close to Casa Botin, there is the famous restaurant Casa Lucio preparing his typical “Huevos Rotos” (Broken eggs), but for me, the better in Cava Baja is Julián de Tolosa. IMHO, this restaurant has the best meat you can find in Madrid and you can eat the Monkfish made as I recommended to D in a previous thread.

If you make a reservation for 6-8 persons, don't forget to ask for the table they have available in the wine cellar, nice and preserved from the rest of the clients, then you can have a great Lunch/Dinner with friends or for business.

[eteditor]

I looked at the tinypic picture that ALLMAN told us about, and I got a notice saying I was the four-and-a-half-billionth person to have downloaded it. If the Spaniards thing that two-thirds of the world's population reads their blogs, I'm not surprised they get so excited about everything.

[xabi]

If you want to eat like a king, come to Asturias. Good meat, fish, seafood, cheese, stews and cider.
And most important of all, you will probably start to appreciate Alonso's fellow countrymen.