What should happen with MPs and their expenses

The Times reported this morning attempts to keep secret how they spend their £23,000 second home allowance - by no longer submitting receipts.

Days after the High Court ordered the publication of every receipt submitted by MPs, a committee reviewing parliamentary expenses is proposing that they should be able to claim the full £23,000 second-home allowance automatically as an annual “block grant”.

This would end the principle whereby MPs are compensated only for “costs incurred” and give nearly 250 MPs who claim less than £23,000 a substantial tax-free income boost.

The justification of those looking at the is:

“Receipted reimbursement is used almost universally for short-term and ad hoc work away from home overnight. For longer-term or more regular work, a daily rate is the norm. If it’s going to extend for more than two years, the norm is a lump sum.”

MPs second home allowance will always be tax free because - wait for it - MPs passed a law in 2003 (consolidating a 1970 law) preventing it from being taxed.

This had already had a huge response on TimesOnline. Amid the fury, there are also some suggestions of what should be done next.

MPs representing seats outside London have to have two homes. It seems fair that their employer helps with this. What system would you suggest?

Here are a flavour of the responses already on Times Online

Garley, London: As an expense payment, this of course will be tax free. So assuming they all steal... sorry, earn above the 40% tax bracket from us already, it will effectively be a near on 40K pay rise. Not bad for a bunch of workshy mediocrities.

Stuart, Worcester, UK: Why are not MP's second homes owned by the Crown? Such a practice works for Servicemen and, through the a different source, the clergy. Security would be easier as anyone can find an MP's address. Reasonable repairs and updates would be similarily funded. Yes, a higher salary. But no sleeze please

David, London: When junior doctors are getting a 20% pay cut as from August and will earn less than a newly qualified nurse. These MPs are a disgrace.

Mike, Dunstable, England: A salary of £61,820 does not attract our best brains.It's a fact that most of our MP's wouldn't get on the short list for a job as C.E. of a medium sized company,yet we allow these 3rd raters to run the country and moan because they make a mess of it.Fewer MP's with larger salaries might help.

Comments

[Garry]

Our MPs should be paid a higher wage. But, expenses should always be open and transparent - you would not get away with submitting an expenses claim without a supporting receipt with either a company (that employs you) or your accountant (if self employed). Our MPs have to be accountable, and any system that supports claims without receipts is tempting dishonesty. We want our MPs to be above that, so pay them a good salaray, but expect the highest standards of openness and honesty of them. Any MP who can't be trusted with expenses surely can't be trusted with running the country.

[Outraged]

What should happen?

EVERY MP that has swindled the British tax payer, should face charges for fraud, repay the amounts swindled and if found guilty of embezzlement; jail and be debarred from public office .

That is the law of the land isn't it, or are MPs above the law too.

[Garry]

Given that any hint of a perk provided by employers results in massive taxation, MP's should be hammered with tax on their perks and most certainly, have all council tax, bin tax car expenses etc taxed at twice the general public so that they can feel what its like living under MP's ill conceived Laws!

[Will H.]

The answer seems quite simple to me: a flat salary. Say £100,000. Nothing more, nothing less. This would wipe out any expenses fiddling and would be more than adequate to sustain any MP.

[Those who really can't become MPs]

Well thats obviously where the money has gone that should give a decent cost of living pay rise to our poor nurses, teachers, firefighters, doctors and other public servants.

A second mortgage to pay for the extra chin that hides the brass neck.

A 35% pay rise. Now THAT is greedy.
Its not even like they earn it.

Parasitic scum!

[Garry]

Given that any hint of a perk provided by employers results in massive taxation, MP's should be hammered with tax on their perks and most certainly, have all council tax, bin tax car expenses etc taxed at twice the general public so that they can feel what its like living under MP's ill conceived Laws!

[curbishly]

Interesting that the allowance the MPs want is the same amount as the national average wage.

[Justice]

Why do we need 650 MPs.

Why dont we have 25 paid MPs per side + 25 made up of the other parties. £100K pa each, taxed and no expenses.

How free accommodation in London for MPs; a compund of simple flats, leased for a small fee (if required) while serving parliament. More secure against terrorism and easier to keep an eye on.

[M. A. Jabbar]

What should we do? Pay for it; as simple as that. They are up to grab; so they shall.

[John]

The higher the salary and the greater the expenses when combined with the ivory tower mentality of Parliament, virtually guarantees a disconnect with the ordinary voter. MPs are truly unaware in many cases about the pain being suffered by ordinary voters. They probably rarely drive, everything is expensed and subsidised and at the end of it you are guaranteed a solid pension after a short career as an MP. It would make far better sense to make MPs subject to the same rules as the majority. Pensions linked to the UK average, a set salary and budget which needs managing and no long term personal gain i.e Second homes funded by the taxpayer. Above all total transparency of funding and activities.

[FEF]

I don't know how we got into the position that MPs set their own pay and perks but it has to change, an independent group made up not of the great and the good who are almost a bad as the MPs, but of ordinary citizens, the voters. And don't try and tell me it's too complicated for ordinary mortals to understand, we know when we are being fiddled and we know about value for money

[brit abroad]

There should be unambiguous guidelines as to what is allowed and not allowed, and it should be paid against receipts, or as a per diem allowance - and made public.

If payments to your campaign are public, why should your expenses not be also?

[Kate]

They should get NO expenses. £75,000 pa and no gold plated pensions they pay like the rest of us. Every penny of tax payers money must have a receipt. If they don't like it then tough. Plenty of people would be more than happy with £75,000. If the present lot were paid on results they'd owe us.

[Roderick Douglas]

Sir

Rather than MPs claiming for a second home, now is possibly the time to build a few accommodation blocks for MPs sio that they do not need to claim for a second home in London. This would have the advantage of saving a lot of money and provided the right facilities were available mean that it would not be necessary to claim a lot of dubious expenses.

[Richard]

MPs expenses should be scrapped and a rise in TAXABLE salary of £ 20,000 per annum introduced immediately. All windfall gains on 'second properties' should go back into the Exchequer thus deterring this nice little tax-free earner MPs pick up when they sell these surplus houses.
Tony Blair should be made to explain why he took out a £ 300,000 mortgage on a property when he owed much,much less....and Gordon Brown can, like the rest of us, pay his own satellite TV bills, TV licence fee and utilities. That way he can start to 'feel our pain'....Chances of that happening ??? Oooh about 10 million to one

[Rich]

The worst thing you can be in this world is a Thief. Get them out of office as soon as possible and then call the Police because they are stealing.

[Jim Prudhoe]

MPs are obviously aware of every possible scam and are perfectly capable of inventing new ones and then legislating them into existence.
It would help if on deselection or voted out that the second home scam is negated by paying back to the treasury the gain on the property with all the treasury provisos. Where there is a married couple one should also include an accumulation of rent for one spouse.

[William]

I firmly believe we should have the Fraud Squad called in to investigate these MP's 'expenses' claims. There is a real case to be made that some of them are/have undoubtably cheated the taxpayer out of monies. I aslo think that the profits they make on the sale of their second homes - which we paid for - should be heavily taxed (around 90% should do). Bottom line? They are scrounging, lying, cheats led by an unelected PM and presided over by a very, very, dubious Speaker.

[Mike]

When I look at Parliment on TV the house is often nearly empty, why are the MP's we pay for, perhaps doing their second lucrative job, or in their second home with their Mistress. All receipts should be checked by the Inland revenue the same as everyone else, ot tax the expenses at 40
per cent and reclaim the tax via receipts.

[Reg]

I would pay them £100k p.a.. No expenses for office work. All secretaries, researchers et al to be paid for centrally and recruited as civil servants. If accomodation is needed for out of town MPs then it should be provided by the state in the same way that police houses existed for constable's families. Furthermore I would prohibit them working for any other body or institution so that their integrity is not compromised. If they are to represent us the tax payer they must be like Caesar's wife. If their sense of duty and desire to work for our benefit and the public good is not enough for them to accept these conditions then we are better off without them. I seem to remember a labour member, Nellist or something like who only took a wage based on the average of his constituent's pay. I think that he was a member for Coventry and was expelled by the labour party for being a member of the socialist workers...well considering how nulabour has turned out, particularly when you consider things like the Bliar's property portfolio you can see why they didn't want people like him in their gang........in fact he made all the chamber look bad! And one more thought a select body of state pensioners should be appointed to regulate their pay awards and my mother should be the chairperson.

[Paul]

MP's London residences should be owned by the Government.

When elected, MPs have a right to require the Government to purchase for them a property which they could otherwise rent for up to a certain amount on the open market. They will then be entitled to live in this property rent free for the duration of their term of office, following which the property will revert to the Government and can then be sold or rented by another MP.

As landlord, the Government would be responsible for certain upkeep costs together with heating and electrical costs.

There is therefore absolutely no opportunity for MPs to benefit personally from their 'second home' allowance and the system can work as originally intended, i.e. to give MPs a base in London.

[Keith]

Is anyone surprised? They have no shame, basically they are all crooks. At the same time as they are introducing more and more taxes for the minority of PAYE slaves in the private sector who actually keep this country afloat the lying hypocrites are going to steal more of your money.

They will get away with it for as long we allow them to. The solution is to write to your MP expressing you feelings and asking them how they would vote on these recommendations. If you aren’t happy with the answer you know what to do, vote for someone else.

What is the Inland Revenue doing about this? If I had large amounts of income that I hadn’t earned but was putting down to ‘expenses’ they would be over me like a rash. Do they have some kind of immunity over us poor serfs?

[Paul Owen]

Let's start a new political party called Reform which will change the way this country is governed and make it accountable and democratic. Part of the manifesto for such a party will be to enshrine a system of salaries for MPs with which they cannot interfere by law. I will stand for parliament on such a manifesto who will join me? Any sitting MP who refuses to back these proposals would have a Reform party candidate stand against them at the next election. If necessary we'll form a government. It's time to put an end to this cosy and corrupting duopoly with their expenses claims, their cash for honours and fighting tooth and nail against revealing how they spend our money on a Sky subscription and new kitchens. Why do they all need new kitchens and why should we pay for them?

[Sammy]

MPs caught thieving should be whipped in public. Gordon Brow should be whipped till his glass eye pops out of its rotting socket.

Damn Nazis - whip them.

[robert]

Just one word GREED