Is it time to give moments of remembrance the silent treatment?

What an irony: football stadiums are quieter than ever these days, except when we want them to be. Last night’s minute’s silence at Wembley to remember the Munich disaster was cut short by the referee, Felix Brych, after just 27 seconds, because some of the crowd failed to observe it.

Oliver Kay explains the rationale in The Times this morning: "The FA had thought long and hard about whether to hold such a tribute in memory of the eight Manchester United players and 15 other victims of the tragedy and, in the event, it was cut short after shouts from a very small but audible minority of spectators. It had been described over the public-address system as a ‘period of silence’, but the match programme clearly stated that it was intended to last the full minute."

We could talk about whether the FA was right to capitulate, as Alyson Rudd does in her powerful article, but there is a more important and wider issue. When it is treated with such disdain, does the tradition of silent remembrance at stadiums have a future?

And is the real reason for the rise of the minute’s applause that clubs want to hide the embarrassment of the vocal minority? Was there so much discussion and fretting about the Munich minute before the game that the publicity encouraged a few fools to act disrespectfully just to go against the grain?

Is football such a morally bankrupt environment that in some minds, hatred of Manchester United outweighs the pathos of young lives cut tragically short? Modern society manages to be both brutally unsympathetic yet increasingly sentimental. Since there seem to be more silences and periods of applause than in decades past, is the convention losing its currency?

Or should we be realistic: in a crowd of over 85,000, perhaps only a few dozen caused trouble, and much of the noise was people “shushing” the original perpetrators.

Is it time to give moments of remembrance the silent treatment? What do you think?

Opinion Polls & Market Research

Comments

[colin bowley]

How about if the culprits are found on CCTV, brought out before everyone onto the pitch, and then Tazered one-by-one and then led away by armed guards with German Shepard dogs snarling at them and snapping at their ankles.
Or is that a bit too much?

[mick]

all true football fans respect each other.

[JIMG]

Why just the Busbie Babes? Lets have a minute when all traffic is stopped to remember all those killed on our roads . Where does it stop! What about the great flu epidemic, or the Plague. The 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month has relevance to us all . Lets just keep it for those extraordinary ordinary heroes.
JimG

[Micky]

People who deliberately don't observe them should be kicked out of the match, no matter whether they paid 15 pound, or 200 pound. The Munich disaster, even though it had greater effect on the Manchester United playing group than any other tragedy, is the same to a United supporter like me as the Hillsborough deaths is to Liverpool supporters.
People who disrespect such tributes aren't real football fans at all and all they are doing is showing that they have no character or soul. I never pick on supporters that were affected by Hillsborough or Heysel, being a United supporter, so no one should be an idiot and mention Munich 1958. The people who insult it to me are generally people whose Clubs have won next to nothing.

[Gareth Crockett]

A lot has been made of the duration of Wednesday's 'minute' silence. However, in the past the same guidelines, whatever they may be - referees discretion, agreed upon shorter period etc - have been adhered to. Following several matches I have watched live on TV, both football and rugby, I have, with the benefit of recordable television, replayed the minutes silence with a stopwatch close by after being sceptical about its length first time round. Never has it gotten close to the full minute. Rightly, it would appear that no journalist or fan observes a moment's remembrance with a chronograph the focus of their attention, rather than the victims and their families. The minute that was yearned for on Wednesday, and similarly will be desired on Sunday, will in all likelihood be a long way off regardless of anyone's behaviour.

[Danielle Blake]

I think it depends on the time and circumstances of the death(s). I believe when a footballer dies after his career has finished, then it would be more appropriate to applaud rather than offer silence, to show appreciation for and celebrate his achievements. In the case of the victims of Munich, there are 2 arguments for silence over applause: firstly the unfulfilled potential. These players - Duncan Edwards in particular - could have gone on to become the best of the best, but they were cut down in their prime before they had a chance to do so, leaving people with nothing but images of what might have been. Secondly, this tragedy changed the set up of an entire football club and the lives of the players' families for the worse. Applause would be inappropriate.

[JS]

The crowd at the new Wembley does seem spectacularly yobbish. They boo the German national anthem, they boo their own players (Bentley, Lampard) and they disrupt a minute's silence.

It might have been a better idea to have a presentation on the pitch to Munich survivors like Bobby Charlton and Harry Gregg - the applause might have drowned out the boos.

We are obviously too loutish and ill-disciplined a country. Having minute's silences is just inviting furher national embarrassment - as if watching England play lately hasn't been bad enough.

[shorehamview]

I firmly believe that a minute's silence should be respected, whether you feel anything for those being remembered or not. I also think that the minute's silence has been over-used.
As previous posters have stated, Armistice Day and a few other occasions are enough.
I empathise with the loss of others, but there are many who cannot see the relevance of the deaths, fifty years ago, of players from a football team they don't support, or even may despise.
It seems these days that football clubs have a minute's silence every other match. Perhaps a minute's applause may be more appropriate for some cases.
And in some cases, should there be any moment of reflection, be it clapping or silence?

[Chris Wigley]

Shouldn't we just identify the culprits on CCTV and remove them from the ground. If this happens a few times this small minority will learn

[Jon]

Yes indeed a minutes silence should be properly observed, but perhaps we reconsider the regularity with which we carry out these silences. Almost every week at one football ground or another there is a minutes silence for some deserving reason but I must perhaps suggest that this detracts from other events such as the memorial silence on 11/11 - a global tragedy rather than a sporting one

[David]

If there were only 10 cretins who could not keep their mouths shut, then surely the people around them could have pointed them out to the stewards. And the Wembley authorities could and should have had the guilty ones ejected.
As a Northerner, I am tempted to think that it's just another blot on London and Wembley, which was only re-built just to resurrect a grotty area. After all, there are plenty of good quality stadia all over the country so why should England just play at Wembley?

[Mike Barlow]

I live in Spain where there are a mindless minority of rascists, such as those "demonstaring" against Lewis Hamilton in Barcelona. I would like to be able to say I'm proud to be British but then I'm reminded that Britain too has its fair share of morons like those who broke the silence at Wembley. Sadly there will probably be others at Old Trafford on Sunday, lets hope the the more intelligent in the crowd and the stewards are able to pick them out and ban them from football for life.

[ces]

Yes, the currency has become devalued through over-use. Nationally, a minute's silence on Armistice Day (millions of young lives cut short) and to mark the death of our head of state is sufficient.
Up to individual clubs whether to mark the passing of whoever they choose in whatever way they think fitting. If they are sensible they will take account of the likely level of bewilderment and/or bile from visiting supporters.
The Munich aircrash was a terrible tragedy for Manchester United and the victims' families, but 'only' a loss to British football as a whole. Fair play to United, they have at least had the decency to wait 50 years to mark the occasion, but I'm not convinced that Wembley was the appropriate place to do this, particularly in front of a crowd where anyone that remembered the event occurring would be in a tiny minority.

[ces]

Yes, the currency has become devalued through over-use. Nationally, a minute's silence on Armistice Day (millions of young lives cut short) and to mark the death of our head of state is sufficient.
Up to individual clubs whether to mark the passing of whoever they choose in whatever way they think fitting. If they are sensible they will take account of the likely level of bewilderment and/or bile from visiting supporters.
The Munich aircrash was a terrible tragedy for Manchester United and the victims' families, but 'only' a loss to British football as a whole. Fair play to United, they have at least had the decency to wait 50 years to mark the occasion, but I'm not convinced that Wembley was the appropriate place to do this, particularly in front of a crowd where anyone that remembered the event occurring would be in a tiny minority.

[Conwykid]

7,500 at The Racecourse Ground in Wrexham for last night's Wales v Norway friendy. Not a sound during the whole minute's silence. Is this an English disease?

[Mike B]

We shouldn't let a minority of disrespectful idiots allow legends of the past who have died tragically to be forgotten by not in future giving them the moments of remembrance they deserve.

[Adam Michie]

I was there last night and in the West end of Wembley there was not a peep from anyone until someone shouted "Shut your f****** mouths", at the shouts coming from the north side of the ground. Out of 86,000 people about 10 people made a noise, and i include the shushers in that as well. It's hardly an endemic problem in football. The majority are shown up by a minority. Such is life me thinks.

[Paul S]

Surely the media are just as much to blame for the contempt shown by modern football fans to tributes and remembrances as anyone else.

Look at your cowardice in ignoring the vile and obscene chants and songs that are still endemic throughout the game; your crass cynicism in moments of horror; (lies about fans urinating on rescuers and stealing from the dead at Hillsborough!).

The great British public is simply a reflection of the great British media, insular, brutish and indifferent to the suffering of others. Yet like Pavlov's Dog you expect the public to drool on command whenever it suits you, as with your treacly coverage of the 50th anniversary of the Munich air crash. Sorry to say but the British media has schooled its public well, you must be so proud!

[Anjellik]

Shouldn't we remember when debating this that the families of those who died were consulted and it was they who wanted a minute's silence as a mark of respect and rememberance? There is a lot to be said for having a minute of applause but in this case it was the families wishes and had less to do with Manchester United than the idiots would probably know about.