Martin Samuel responds to comments on whether the Premier League should play a 39th match abroad

Right, well the debate bit the dust this week. I asked who in their right mind would want the Republic of Ireland job, and it turned out the answer was Giovanni Trapattoni. Presumably, Billy Davies wasn’t available after all. Still credit where it is due, well done gentlemen, although if you think our own dear Fabio Capello likes to keep it tight, wait till you get a load of your bloke.

This does not mean we cannot have a heated debate, though. This 39th match business would appear to have got a few people going, including me. I’ve written three pieces on it in six days and by mid-day on Wednesday you guys had contributed roughly 6,500 words by way of response, so let’s go.

The clue is in the name: English Premier League. That is how it should remain. Why should English supporters be punished with an unfair league simply because the American and Asian competitions are not as good? We have built and maintained this wonderful league; others can enjoy it via their television sets, and if you want one as good, build it yourself. Farid Charidine, Milton Keynes.

MS: The idea of the symmetrical league has stood in English football since the creation of the Football League in 1888. Few ideas last 120 years without improvement, so this one must be good. Why change?

The difference between football and America’s NFL is that, to my knowledge, there are only two countries that play the game professionally (the United States and Canada). Attempts to launch the sport elsewhere have floundered due to lack of interest (most recently NFL Europa), so there is still the ambition to export. The same cannot be said for football, which is firmly established in most countries. Ian Thomson, Houston, Texas, USA.

MS: The idea that we are promoting football round the world expired long ago. I can appreciate that the NFL is trying to get a foothold in other countries, albeit for financial reasons.

Oh, give it a rest. Has it only taken the fans this long to realise that the clubs don't care? There is too much moaning far too late. You'll either keep going and if you don't then there are thousands of fans waiting to take your place. Stop whining and shut up. Justin, Leicester.

MS: Ah, the voice of pure cynicism. I thought that was my job. I think you are being a little harsh on the fans here, Justin. Yes, money has ruled the roost for many years now but, if you love the sport, what are you going to do? You might not like it, but you go along with it. In every movement there is a tipping point, however, and with the 39th game we might have reached it.

As usual, British people do not understand. English clubs would be worth small percentages of what they are worth now without a global market. Without the money generated by outside interests, the British public does not have the money to sustain the levels of pay. Freaking out about one match is true snobbery. John, London.

MS: I think the British people are aware of global market forces, John, and have put up with strange kick-off times and bizarre pre-season tours as part of the arrangement that helps bring money and talent to our game. Until now, this has not impacted on the fairness of the competition and that is why most are drawing a line. I don’t think that makes them snobs.

Last weekend I took my two children to watch Liverpool play Sunderland at Anfield. Total cost, including travel from Cheltenham, approx £200, entertainment value, virtually nil. And now the Premier League is saying, sorry that's not enough, we need even more revenue and will sacrifice the integrity of the competition to generate the cash. I feel mugged - my club is owned by American capitalists who don't care about anything but profit, the players are earning obscene amounts to turn in indifferent performances, and the governing body is prepared to sell its soul for a few dollars more. As painful as this will be after 40 years of loyal support I have come to the end. Football has lost its soul. My kids deserve better. Philip, Cheltenham.

MS: You could always take them to watch Cheltenham, Philip. Home to Hartlepool on Saturday, if you are interested.

What I don't understand is we were all told that managers should not expect a wonderful and ancient tournament like the Africa Cup of Nations to be changed (and rightly so) because  it is becoming a big event held in a continent whose passion for the game is well documented. Then we are told that it is not a wholly commercial exercise to play Premier League games abroad, yet there is not a single African country being touted as a possible venue. Paul, London.

MS: The Premier League is like any other hooker: the more you pay, the more passionate they get.

If money is the only motivation, how long until you enjoy the game subdivided into four quarters to make room for more commercials? How long until time outs, coach’s challenges and two minute warnings? Although I love the Bundesliga, I have never doubted that the Premier League has more pace, passion and excitement. I used to envy you but that will be a thing of the past soon, too. Joaquin, Dusseldorf, Germany.

MS: I have no doubt this is the thin end of a very large wedge, whatever Richard Scudamore’s protestations.

If the league want a set of meaningful matches, then have an end of season tournament between the top eight sides, with the four semi-finalists getting into the Champions League. You can even have a meaningful third and fourth place play off match. This way the league would be more open, since coming 8th would give a chance a getting into Europe. This play-off could take place abroad. I wonder how much the host city would pay for it? Alan Dow, Fleet.

MS: I think we all owe a debt of gratitude to Alan for proving that, just when you thought things could not get any worse, they most certainly could. He’s being ironic, right? Meanwhile, in the red corner, wearing the star spangled trunks and representing an electoral process nobody understands, soft rock and a four-hour line at immigration is David Jones of San Diego, California…

If this proposal goes ahead, it will mean that one game out of 39 will be played outside England, which is 2.6 per cent of the complete schedule. From what I've been reading, the next time the Premier League TV rights are sold, approximately 50 per cent of the revenue will come from outside England. There is a huge market of real fans out here, and they are just as deserving of seeing games in the flesh as fans in England. Playing games at international locations also makes business sense, and the purists should remember that this is a business. David Jones, San Diego, California, USA.

MS: And in the blue corner, wearing union jack trunks and representing everything that is right, roast beef, Yorkshire pudding and the best bands on the planet is DohDohDoh of Newcastle…

David Jones is correct. There is ‘a huge market of real fans that are just as deserving of seeing games in the flesh as fans in England’ and all they have to do is get on a plane and fly over here to watch them. DohDohDoh, Newcastle.

MS: This is a tough one. We may have to go to a deciding judge.

David Jones: why not watch the MLS and support a team near your house? Phil Darnton, Manchester.

MS: We have a winner.

To have 39 fixtures means that some teams will automatically get an unfair advantage, simply by drawing whipping boys like Derby County for their extra game, removing the inherent fairness of playing everyone twice. Also, the idea that the top five are seeded to avoid each other is going to help make the Premier League less competitive because it gives the biggest clubs an extra winnable game and removes the possibility that they concede points to each other. Paul, Bermondsey.

MS: There you go again, using the principles of logic and fairness. Suspend those and it all makes sense.

The money in the Premier League comes from huge television rights. A major contributor to this value is the continent of Asia and undermining its importance smells of jingoistic nationalism. Asian fans do deserve a game for the money they have started to indirectly contribute to the English game. Sidhant, Delhi, India.

MS: All Asia’s money entitles is the right to watch a match. Not to host one, organise one or have a say in the structure of the league, Take your money elsewhere if that is how you feel. Presumably, if you went to the theatre you would demand control over the way the play ended?

If ‘Asian fans deserve a game for the money they have contributed to the English game’, can I now have a brick from the Great Wall of China as reward for the European tourists that indirectly pay for its maintenance? Jerome, Brussels, Belgium.

MS: I’m going to Milan twice in the next few weeks: ten more visits and I shall demand the lead tenor of La Scala flies over and gives me a song. Nothing too heavy, though. No Wagner.

It is a self-defeating proposal. If you rate a league by its commercial size then the English Premier League is a huge success. So what shall we do now? Take the ‘English’ bit out. A move to internationalism only makes logical sense if we intend to gradually go down the path to complete globalization with Arsenal in Tokyo and Chelsea in Dubai (we wish). And as Scudamore has stated this will not happen what is the point? Fashions will move on as developing countries create successful domestic enterprises and people will no longer crave a patronising gift of one English game. The league will end up looking ridiculous playing to empty stadiums, thousands of miles from home. East Asia is a very nationalistic place and in every industry the aim is to have domestic entities grow to rival the foreign ones. Sport is no different. It will not be long before people in Beijing, Shanghai, Seoul and Tokyo want one of their teams in the league. And they will pay top dollar to get the best local and foreign footballers playing for them. If the EPL does not let this happen, then gradually either domestic leagues or some alternative international club league will be formed and the Premier League will be ignored. Dave Williams, Beijing, China.

MS: Spot on, Dave. The moment Asian football creates its own heroes, English football will be abandoned.

I'll be very interested to see the reaction of the host cities to hosting games involving teams outside the big four. Here in Melbourne, for example, we have a tennis grand slam, a Formula One Grand Prix, World Cup qualifiers, plus international rugby and cricket. You'll forgive me if I don't see 16th v 9th in the Premier League getting marquee status. Andrew, Melbourne, Australia.

MS: Exactly. The Premier League play a pre-season tournament abroad but without one of the big four it would be dead on its feet.

I suggest a finals series where there is a top ten and opportunities for upsets and underdog teams to ride a wave of inspiration to the final. The best team would still have the best chance of winning, but it gives lesser clubs who cannot keep up with the sheer consistency of the big clubs a chance. Best of all, it is simply more exciting and romantic than watching a big four club wrap it up with eight games remaining. Paul, Sydney, Australia.

MS: Alternatively, Paul why not have every team play each other twice and, at the end, the best team wins? Works for me.

Perhaps the Premier League could consider a rule whereby all first team squad members must play a percentage of games unless unavailable through injury or international call-up. This would prevent the top four overloading their squads. Richie R, Newcastle.

MS: An interesting idea but probably unenforceable, not least because all clubs would then claim to have squad players injured, exhausted or dropping like flies with mystery viruses.

I believe clubs should be docked points for making a loss. It is ridiculous that Chelsea can lose tens of millions each year yet win the Premier title. Paul Esson, Cape Town, South Africa.

MS: I hear this argument a lot but I don’t agree with it. All that would happen then is the league would become a closed shop with the richest at the top and the poorest unable to find a way up. The financial aspect of league competition is now so great that there is no hope of progress unless a generous owner like Roman Abramovich is prepared to overspend by millions. All this scheme would do, Paul, is kill the dreams of fans that somewhere out there is the man who will elevate their club.

The top five Premier League finishers each season should receive a meaningful cash payment and then be moved down two leagues where for the next two seasons they could deliver ticket sales and TV money to the other leagues as they work their way up, potentially picking up cheaper and more promising English players en route. Richard Mee, Cambridge.

MS: It’s hard to know where to start with this one. So you win the league and get relegated? I take it you’re not at the university

If I read another reference to the EPL I will scream. This is getting close to ‘soccer’ as an irritant. J.Wilkes, Gloucester.

MS: You’re not going to like Michael from Sydney, then.

The EPL could bring in a banded salary cap linked to first team appearances, then you would get some heartfelt thought from players before jumping ship to the big four reserves. Michael Holloway, Sydney, Australia.

MS: Interesting idea, though, as much as I am against a salary cap the problem of elite clubs taking key players at small clubs only to abandon them to bit part involvement requires some thought.

There is massive interest out here for the English game, but it is still a finite interest. There was massive interest in the first Shanghai Grand Prix, too, and then they couldn’t give tickets away for the second. Without the emotional attachment, fans in Asia have proven themselves to be far more resistant to exploitation than their British counterparts (both Manchester United and Real Madrid have failed to sell out Hong Kong stadium on at least one recent visit due to high prices and bad PR). As for Everton versus Portsmouth in Mumbai, the only reason these clubs get crowds at home is because they are at home. Andy, Hong Kong.

MS: I agree, Andy. We may have overplayed our hand considerably on this one.

Comments

[Simon Bougourd]

A compromise. Play all England home internationals in Asia - honestly, it would be doing us a favour.

[Roland Larsson]

Fix EPL? As a pensioneer owner of a successful bussiness, I say; Let it be. Enjoy. Don't fix it. Just mess with the mail and your managers a while in the morning and take someone for lunch.

[Chris]

Your respondent from Milton Keynes says "We have built and maintained this wonderful league; others can enjoy it via their television sets, and if you want one as good, build it yourself".
I have no idea which team Farid supports, but living in a town that created "Franchise FC", I suggest he directs the same points to Peter Winkelman, chairman of Franchise FC, and who killed off Wimbledon to steal its league place rather than "build it himself".
Winkie is the perfect example of money men/ property developers who now run the game for their own financial interests, even when it's in direct opposition to the history and purpose of English football. The premier League's latest announcement is just a continuation of that process.

[Chrissy]

Also, seriously, Football in the US tends to be followed by middle to upper middle class latte liberals. Can they not afford a trip once a year to England? It's cheap in January.